Second Act Success Career Podcast
Season 1 - ​​When Stressful Jobs Lead To Unhealthy Lifestyles | Ep #103
Episode - #103
Host: Shannon Russell
Guest: Katherine Baldwin
Transcription (*created by Descript and may not be perfectly accurate)

[00:00:00] Katherine Baldwin: when I get off the plane with Tony Blair, everyone else goes back to their families.

And I would go back to my one bedroom flat. On my own and stop at the supermarket on the way home and buy myself something to eat and then go back to work the next day. What has been the point of my life and why am I doing this and what's the point of success if there's no one by my side or if I'm not happy or if I'm not healthy?

[00:00:57] Shannon Russell: If You are a workaholic, if [00:01:00] you have climbed the corporate ladder, if you have woken up exactly where you set out to be only to find that it's not working any longer

then you are in the right place. My friend. Today's topic is all about listening to your body, listening to your heart and making a decision about your future based on taking care of you.

I will be sitting down with journalists, turned author, Katherine Baldwin. Katherine admits that she woke up one day and realized that she had let success get the best of her. Throughout her career, she had formed unhealthy habits.

That she had to change.

In doing so she found herself right where she wanted to be as an author, midlife mentor and relationship coach. Let me introduce you to Katherine Baldwin.

[00:01:48] Shannon Russell: Katherine, welcome to

[00:01:49] Katherine Baldwin: Second Act Success. Thank you, Shannon. It's lovely to be here.

[00:01:52] Shannon Russell: You have quite the story and I can't wait to dive into it. Why don't you tell us where your career journey began.

[00:01:59] Katherine Baldwin: I began [00:02:00] my career as a journalist, although I hadn't actually studied journalism.

I studied French and Spanish at Oxford University, and my desire was to travel and to be paid for it. When I was at school, I considered numerous options, such as, a hostess, travel agent. But when I left university, I didn't know what I wanted to do. I just knew I wanted to travel.

I had lived in Spain for a year. I had loved it. I spoke good Spanish, so I went traveling. I went to Australia, New Zealand, and then I went to the States and then I traveled into Mexico and I ran out of money. And the hostel where I was staying, someone suggested that I go to the local newspaper and try and get a job.

I did, I went to the English language speaking newspaper and I got a job and that's where my journalism began. I was 25 and I rang my mom and I said, I'm in Mexico.

I've got a job and I'm staying. And I stayed for five years and. Went [00:03:00] from English language newspaper to another one and then to Bloomberg. and I received great training on the job in journalism from my mentors and then I moved to Brazil and worked for Reuters,

had a great time there for a few years, When I was in Brazil, I was, I really wanna go home. I'm homesick. I've been gone for 10 years,

[00:03:20] Shannon Russell: It's a lot on your

[00:03:21] Katherine Baldwin: own. and then I moved back to London I worked as a political journalist based in the Houses of Parliament. So it was a top job. I felt like I wanted to go home, but I kind of needed to go home on a high. Yeah. It sort of psychologically, I needed to go home, not as a. broke, unemployed person, and I, really did, I really went to the top and I got this job as a Reuters political journalist based in Parliament, which involved traveling around the world with the Prime Minister of the day.

Traveling to war zones and, the White House and Europe and [00:04:00] Asia, and reporting on politics. So it was a, big job and I did it for six years. I. Oh,

[00:04:07] Shannon Russell: how incredible. And I think it's interesting because we both kind of got our start in journalism or communications. I was a television producer, so I, know the traveling and the hours and just the stress, it's a big job and you're around a lot of people and everyone thinks it's so glamorous, but there's a lot of long hours stress and pressure in that industry.

Do you wanna talk a little bit about that, being in your. Twenties, having this really impactful position,

[00:04:38] Katherine Baldwin: you are right. There was huge stress and pressure and I dealt with it, using.

Binge eating, overeating, comfort eating, stress eating and binge drinking. That's how I dealt with it and I dealt with it in that way in Mexico and Brazil. And I was in my twenties in [00:05:00] Mexico and Brazil and on the one hand it was great fun and all the partying and all the people I met and I was also using these.

Unhealthy behaviors. , and then I moved to London. I was 32 I think, when I started my job in London. So, that job was early thirties and for the first while I was still coping. Using these unhealthy coping mechanisms. I was constantly stressed and adrenalized, I had huge imposter syndrome.

despite having gone to Oxford University and multilingual, that didn't matter because I'm from a single parent family in Liverpool. We grew up, not with a huge amount of money from divorce , and I had this huge sense of imposter syndrome, which meant I had to prove myself all the time.

You know, I had to be perfect. I had to be better than the day before and better than [00:06:00] everyone else, and. You know, I never gave myself a break. So those huge, transatlantic trips with Prime ministers and also working for Reuters, which is a 24 7 news agency. So unlike the newspapers that they had time off and they had deadlines to file.

My office was always open. might have been closed in London, but it was open in New York or in Tokyo. So I was always working and, Yeah, it was exhausting the perfectionism, the stress, the fear, and nobody knew I did a great

[00:06:31] Shannon Russell: job. Well, you had to because you're here with the Prime Minister.

You're here with all of these people that you have to have your best face forward at all times,

[00:06:39] Katherine Baldwin: yeah. Even the plane journeys, like, yeah. I started my job for Reuters in London. As the buildup to the Iraq war was happening, and there was a plane journey that I was on with Prime Minister Tony Bl when he said, well, well, when something happened that was shattering in the news.

And so then there's a [00:07:00] live press conference on the plane with this earth shattering news. And then you're trying to use these airplane phones to phone your desk with the news and. As is everyone else at the same time. And, yeah, it was crazy. There was no sort of downtime on the plane to read your book.

It's like, prep for the next leg or there's these live news conferences that suddenly get sprung on you. So, Did you

[00:07:25] Shannon Russell: love it though? Like were there just times that maybe now you can look back and go, that was so cool that I experienced that and as stressful as it might've been, I was there when that breaking news came about, or I was in that war zone covering it.

So are there highlights that you look back on with fondness

[00:07:43] Katherine Baldwin: I feel excited talking about it so clearly. , you know, just talking about that moment and that story, In a way, I mean, you've never felt more alive. yes, you have, a seat, a first row seat at historical events. I was at the earthquake in [00:08:00] Haiti. I was at the tsunami in Asia. The terrorist attacks in London. The terrorist attack attacks in Madrid. I was there, I was there when Tony Blair and George Bush were talking about invading Iraq, so, yeah, I was there with my ringside seat, history.

and when I look back to that life, especially the Mexico and Brazil, stage, Great friends that were absolutely family to me and, kind of living the dream in many ways. I think the problem was it was unsustainable. Mm-hmm. So something had to give at some point and that's what happened.

[00:08:41] Shannon Russell: Something has to give and I like that you said it wasn't sustainable. My second act came in is where I realized this isn't sustainable for this. Next part of my life, and mine came when I had my children and I realized I can't be traveling, it wasn't [00:09:00] sustainable for that part, even though I absolutely loved it.

And I'm wondering what your breaking point was and what made you realize that this wasn't sustainable for you, for the remainder of your life.

[00:09:12] Katherine Baldwin: it's really interesting because, One of the reasons, perhaps you say, you know, for you because you had children. One of the reasons for me could be because I didn't have children, I hadn't had children, and there were a number of wake up calls, so there was.

A moment of realization around food, and that happened a year after I'd got back to London. So I was 33 I think, when I started to open, my eyes, come out of denial about the way I was eating. And I think for all those previous years, I hadn't really realized what I was doing.

I hadn't really understood why I was overweight or why I couldn't stop eating as soon as I started. . Or why I went to the doctor and got diet pills to lose weight. I kind of thought all that was [00:10:00] normal, you know? So I came out of denial around the food and I started to do my job without overeating, and that was very difficult because the food had masked my fear and my low self-esteem.

And so I'm still doing the same job, but I'm not numb. Anymore to my fear or to my imposter syndrome or my low self-esteem. And then there was a rock bottom around alcohol when after work you go out and you drink and it's happy hour and you drink too much.

And my body was very good at, drinking a lot for many years. And then, um, I collapsed one night in my bedroom, late at night. I kind of blacked out and I lived on my own. I was in the bathroom, I could have hit my head. and that was quite a wake up call around the alcohol, That wasn't a good way to treat myself.

And there was also crazy stuff , with men and relationships and that drinking that I [00:11:00] just spoke about, that episode involved a man. I'd been out drinking with him. On that occasion, I'd actually walked away, which was a miracle because I often ended up in relationships that weren't good for me.

and then my dad died when I was 30. Six, I think. or 35, which now sounds so young. I'm 52. And that was a massive wake up call because, um, I looked at my life. Not only was I. Going through my dad's death on my own without a partner, without support.

But losing my dad that whole circle of life. You know who, comes after me? I don't have children. my brother had two children, so, know, you lose your father, but you're so busy looking after your young kids Maybe it doesn't hurt so much, or you've got that circle of life going on and I was completely on my own, no one to support me through that.

These questions started to come like, What was it all for? What [00:12:00] was all that striving for? What was all that? Working for? Why have I built this career and this incredible resume? What was the point of that and this flat that I own in London and these nice clothes that I can afford to buy with my salary.

You know, what is the point of all that if I'm waking up alone every morning and. I have to face my dad's death on my own, and I don't have children. And when I get off the plane with Tony Blair, everyone else goes back to their families.

And I would go back to my one bedroom flat. On my own and stop at the supermarket on the way home and buy myself something to eat and then go back to work the next day. What has been the point of my life and why am I doing this and what's the point of success if there's no one by my side or if I'm not happy or if I'm not healthy?

[00:12:56] Shannon Russell: The fact that you realize this wasn't fulfilling you all of this [00:13:00] success and all of this money and excitement just wasn't fulfilling you and that.

Was your wake up call okay, so what would fulfill me? And did you know what that would be? And were you willing to just give up everything you worked for? Because I think that's the hard part is realizing I climbed this ladder and now I'm not happy. Do I take an action step to change it or do I just keep going with what I've accomplished and just hope things will change?

[00:13:29] Katherine Baldwin: the thing is I wasn't willing, but then I, got to the point where I didn't have a choice. And I'll just say as well, the other element in my kind of breakdown was realizing that the job I was doing, The actual content of it no longer fulfilled me.

I write down what the Prime Minister says. Big deal. He says something, I write it down, and there was something missing and I think it was me I was missing.

Mm-hmm. I was missing in that equation. I just write it down. I guess I [00:14:00] wanted to be saying stuff or doing stuff. Writing your own words. Yes. Yeah. I suppose what I thought I knew at that moment was that I didn't wanna be a journalist anymore, and I didn't want to write anymore.

But I wasn't willing to leave my job. And what happened was I basically, Burnt out and broke down and was signed off work by my doctor. So I was told to take some time off work, which was a huge blow to my pride. And to me as a survivor, I always have to power through.

So I took, the enforced time off work and a bit more time and a bit more time. And then I went back on a phased return. And then I guess when I went back doing the same trips, going to Afghanistan with foreign secretary and so forth, realizing that this absolutely doesn't fulfill me at all anymore.

I know too much about myself, so what happened was a miracle, I often say this [00:15:00] to my clients or to people who are in a similar situation. I think we have to somehow put it out there, into the world, into the universe, and into our own consciousness that we are not happy and that something needs to change.

And I remember talking to people and crying and saying, I know it needs to change, but I don't know how. ' cause I had a big, mortgage on my flat. I had a lifestyle to maintain my mom was still alive, but she didn't have any means to support me. So there was no, safety net.

No one to lean on. So I didn't know what to do and, but I put it out there. I knew I needed to change, I needed to leave. And as a miracle, Thompson of Canada decided to buy Reuters and there was a merger and I decided to take voluntary redundancy from my big job, which came as a surprise , to my boss.

And with that came some money and still no idea what I was gonna do, but at least I had a bit of a safety net [00:16:00] with that redundancy, to figure things out.

[00:16:02] Shannon Russell: Did you feel better instantly? You were unsure of what was next, but did you just feel a sigh of relief that that was no longer going to be your

[00:16:11] Katherine Baldwin: lifestyle?

You know what my journey is never straightforward and I think maybe I felt a little bit of relief, and then instantly I felt afraid because it was a finite amount of money and I didn't know what I was going to do next, I didn't really give myself time to think. I just kind of panicked and I thought, I need a job. So I actually went back to what was then Thomson Reuters and worked in a different division in, the foundation, Thomson Reuters Foundation, which had a focus on disasters and emergencies and reporting humanitarian events.

So it felt like a bit of a shift into something. Closer to my heart. I worked there four days a week, or three days a week. And in the extra days I was starting to, explore different options.

It was less pressure. But it was a kind of [00:17:00] a fear-based decision. Or maybe it was an uncertainty based decision. I don't really know where I'm going, so I'm gonna do this for a while.

[00:17:09] Shannon Russell: And in that same time, were you kind of finding your own self recovery and just kind of getting yourself into a better place?

Yes, I

[00:17:17] Katherine Baldwin: was. So, I was continuing my journey of, , healing from my eating disorder. And I learned to manage.

my feelings without food. And I also, looked at my kind of work addiction , and relationship struggles and codependency. And I was in therapy. And I also studied canceling and psychotherapy 'cause that was my next, career path potentially was to be a psychotherapist.

I suppose, something that really shifted was I went to , a conference about women and eating disorders and went out of interest at that conference I had this kind of. know had a lot of anger 'cause there was all these stories about, these women dying of anorexia [00:18:00] or trying to desperately to be thin and obsessed with their weight.

And it had been my story, you know, like starving, binge eating, starving binge eating. at that conference I was about to turn 40 I remember sitting on the toilet. Looking at my thighs and criticizing them and sort of pressing them and thinking, gosh, they wobble. And then I remember having this, what am I doing?

And it just felt so ridiculous and such a terrible waste of my time and my energy, and my intelligence and my creativity. And I got really angry. And I went home and I started to write a blog I was about to turn 40.

I would blog for 40 days and I would try and be abstinent. 'cause at lent, we kind of give things up, don't we? So I would give up self-criticism, self-judgment, self blame. I would give up giving myself and my body a hard time for 40 [00:19:00] days, and I would blog about it every day.

So I did that. I blogged every day for 40 days. I. it was amazing because while I had thought I would want to stop writing after leaving Reuters, I suddenly. Wanted to write, but in a very different way. I wanted to write about me. I wanted to write about eating disorders and women and wellbeing and relationships and being 40 and single and not having kids.

And I wanted to write about all these topics. I suppose for the first time, like real connection with people through my writing. Like women would write to me and say, oh, I've just read your blog. You're telling my story.

I'm also single. I'm also 40. I also don't have children, and thank you for telling my story. it was just so uplifting and moving and validating. Yeah, I was being authentic. Mm-hmm. I was writing from my heart and I was getting a wonderful response.

I suppose that was the start of my second act.

[00:20:00]

[00:20:26] Katherine Baldwin: So using my skills from before in a much more authentic way.

So the blog, led me to do more journalism, freelance, but on topics that I really cared about. I wrote for the national newspapers on. Eating disorders and being single and 40 and not having kids. I went on the radio and spoke about it. so I was, erring these topics. And then I decided, To write a book which isn't the book that I now have out.

It's a different book, which I still need to finish. And I have been inspired very recently to finish that book.[00:21:00] Oh, you haven't finished it? That one, I had success with it in the sense of, I, I wrote an article in the paper. I got invited on News Night, which is a very prominent news television program here in the uk.

I got offers from five I. Literary agents to represent me and I chose an agent. She sent it out to the publishers. This book was about, The phenomenon of women turning 40, being single, not having children. Unfortunately all the publishers said no.

They said, who's gonna read that book? So

[00:21:31] Shannon Russell: many of us. I'm so glad you're going to revisit that because I. could just name a million friends to buy that for. Really

[00:21:39] Katherine Baldwin: honestly. Yeah. Yeah. I'm definitely gonna revisit it. But what happened at the time was the agent didn't sell the book and I lost my confidence.

I kind of lost my way. I took 11 nos from the 11 top publishers in the uk. I took that as a no. I took that to mean. That it [00:22:00] wasn't right or it wasn't good enough, and maybe it wasn't the right approach at the time. But found my way with another book because in the meantime my life was moving on and having done tons of work on myself, lots of therapy, and studied therapy, I was finally figuring out where I was going wrong with my romantic relationships I was starting to date differently and stop all the dysfunctional patterns, which are very common To my friends and my clients and probably women, you know, like falling for unavailable people, pushing away the available people. Fear of commitment. Fear of losing freedom. Fear, fear, fear, fear. And I, um, I started to figure it out and I started to have healthier experiences.

And then I, met someone and I decided to experiment with moving out of London to the coast, to the south of England where the beaches are. I've always loved the beaches. , and to give that relationship a go.

[00:23:00] So I experimented with a six month move to the coast and Our relationship worked. So then we bought a house then I started writing my book, called How to Fall in Love because I had learned so much, right. And I had managed to fall in love, which was absolute miracle for me.

I'd had lots of relationships, I'd had lots of painful experiences and I felt like I was banging my head against a brick wall for many years. So the fact that I'd worked it out felt like I needed to tell people. I wrote how to Fall in love, and the week after I, published it, my partner had proposed, and then we got married.

few years after that. It took us a while, and then that was, I suppose, the next step in my second act career because as I was writing the book, I was aware that there were loads of women who needed this information. And I started to run a course called How to Fall in Love.

At the same time, I thought I'm gonna wanna retreat. So I had 10 women on my first coaching course, I decided to wanna retreat. I filled the [00:24:00] retreat and that began. My, coaching, business, my new career.

So writing books that say things that I think need to be said so that how to fall in love, my experience sharing that with others. I will return to the, the book about. Being 40 and single. Mm-hmm I have another book on emotional overeating that I'm writing and I'm writing a novel, which I am halfway through.

Based on your

[00:24:30] Shannon Russell: life and your experience, or is it completely different?

[00:24:33] Katherine Baldwin: It draws on so many aspects of my life and my experience, and it touches on all the topics that I touch on in my coaching business. It encompasses a lot of my life and I really hope as well as being a brilliant read and hopefully a wonderful movie

[00:24:50] Shannon Russell: I've been thinking this whole time. This is a movie.

It's so interesting to me that this just threads everything that you have gone through. [00:25:00] Writing as a journalist, now writing as an author to help others, it's just a perfect thread of everything from your life's

[00:25:07] Katherine Baldwin: work.

absolutely. And that's what's so amazing about these second acts. We don't have to throw away. Everything that we have learned and built and all the skills, in fact, we can amplify them. My book, how to Fall in Love, I wrote so quickly, lightning speed because I can, because for years for Reuters, I wrote thousands of words a day in articles, thousands.

And they were well-written words as well. 'cause they had to be. My brain knows how to structure information, so that's a good skill. In my coaching business, I'd studied canceling and psychotherapy, and I'd been in therapy for loads of years. Mm-hmm.

So I have deep knowledge, not only of coaching, but also of the psychotherapeutic side of things and the deep blocks and trauma. So I'm a trauma informed coach, I understand how trauma affects us and how we can [00:26:00] heal from it. And also, what was wonderful in my journalism career was, you ask a lot of questions, don't you?

In my coaching business, I meet amazing people from all over the world and I asked them a lot of questions And often these are, people, mostly women who are in exactly the same situation that I was in. many of them are early forties, don't have children, maybe want to have children.

I. Or maybe want to find a different life, want to find a partner, don't understand why they're not finding a partner, or they feel completely unfulfilled in their job as a lawyer or an accountant or the doctor that their parents said they should be. Mm-hmm.

[00:26:39] Shannon Russell: and you're giving them that hope and you're that example of I had all of this success. I was not happy. Look what I was able to turn this into. So having you gone through similar situations can really help them break through

[00:26:54] Katherine Baldwin: My work is about connecting to ourselves and our feelings so that we can, tap into [00:27:00] our true, authentic selves, but also connect to others on a deep level.

I had a fortress when I was working in, in, in journalism. I had my fortress, I had my money, I had my salary, I had my flat, my clothes, so we have these fortresses, don't we? We have these.

Safety nets and we cling to them. And then for many people, second act is about breaking free and having the courage to go for it.

[00:27:27] Shannon Russell: Yes. Maybe it's not the. External love of a partner, but it just looking inwards and loving yourself to realize that we get this one life and you don't wanna wake up at the end and know that I missed doing all of this because of my fortress, Because I was stuck and safe and just didn't wanna shake that norm. That's a sad thing, I think, to get to that place where there could be so much more joy when you do shake things up and you break through and you really find who you're meant to be. And you and I both could have [00:28:00] remained in in media, remained with that lifestyle, and we would be very different women than we are right now.

And the fact that we broke free. Now we're able to help others kind of break free and find themselves too, is I think for me, the most satisfying and the most rewarding path to be on, to just be able to show others the way to find that. And I feel like that's exactly what you're doing too,

[00:28:26] Katherine Baldwin: Catherine.

Yeah. Yeah, it is. It's so, you know, we want to use our experience to help others and we also want to find, purpose in our pain. And I also want to continue to break myself free because, a journey for me.

It's a journey. I've had to overcome lots of my own dysfunctional coping mechanisms, the legacy of trauma from my childhood, and it's an ongoing journey. And, you know, I need to continue to break myself free I can only take people as far as I have gone. My therapist always reminds me, you know, so I have to keep.

Moving [00:29:00] forwards, finding more freedom for myself so that I can keep inspiring others because Yeah. And then we can change the world. Mm-hmm. You know, but we can't change the world if we're not taking a chance taking a risk and being courageous and going for it.

[00:29:18] Shannon Russell: And you're doing that with your work and with your books, and it's just incredible how much your life has transitioned and how you've fallen in love and found love within yourself and are helping others.

[00:29:30] Katherine Baldwin: So what is one

[00:29:31] Shannon Russell: piece of advice that you would give to someone who is about to start their second act

[00:29:35] Katherine Baldwin: today?

It can feel completely daunting and overwhelming to think I need to absolutely change my life. So how can you change one little thing? How can you take baby steps and. Build up small elements of change and how can you dip your toe in the water of a new life?

I know that when I decided to leave my. [00:30:00] London Life. I moved to the sea. The way I did that was I rented my flat out for six months with the option of going back after six months, and I came here as an experiment and I didn't move in with my now husband. I moved into a friend's room, so I kept my independence.

And some people might do it differently, but that's how I did it and that's how I felt comfortable doing it, that this was an experiment. So experiment, dip your toe in the water and do take little steps. You never know where you'll end up and you'll never know where you'll end up. Yeah.

[00:30:32] Shannon Russell: Okay, so where can my listeners connect with you? Follow, you buy your book, all of the things.

[00:30:38] Katherine Baldwin: You can find everything at katherinebaldwin.com, so you'll find a link to my book.

My book is also on Amazon, How to Fall in Love, a 10 step Journey to the Heart. And there are courses, there's coaching one-to-one. , I'm looking to do more retreats, so hopefully there'll be some of those when your listeners have a look at my [00:31:00] website and you can also find me on Instagram @katherinebaldwin.

I'd love your listeners to connect with me. It'd be lovely to, to hear from them.

[00:31:07] Shannon Russell: I'll list all of this in the show notes of the episode as well so they can easily grab it for you. And Catherine, this was just so lovely. I feel like we could have talked all day, and I just thank you for sharing your journey with us.

It's very inspiring.

[00:31:20] Katherine Baldwin: Thank you so much. Because, you know, I get really excited talking about this and your questions are really, Helped me to understand everything that I've gone through and how I can support others, and I'm very grateful to you for hosting this podcast and all the wonderful work that you do too.

Thank you,

[00:31:37] Shannon Russell: Catherine. I'm excited to

[00:31:38] Katherine Baldwin: keep supporting you. Oh, thank you.

[00:32:00]